Date   
Re: Good 2m rig?

Steve McGrane <temporarilyoffline@...>
 

> Why do so many of you want a DIN-6 port? ...

I totally agree with you. I don't really "want" a din-6, but the DRAWS uses it (because the radios use it), so that's what I "need".

USB has done a fantastic job of becoming ubiquitous though...  but even then, my FT-891 doesn't supply audio over the USB port, so I need the data port.  At least this DIN-6 port is somewhat "standard".  I have 2 radios with DIN-13 ports that don't match at all, and might actually fry something if cross connected.  YUCK!

I've been on the "bleeding" edge of tech for many years now and I'm always amazed at how far behind HAM really is.


On Fri, May 24, 2019 at 4:16 PM Al Szymanski via Groups.Io <aszy=mac.com@groups.io> wrote:
Not so much as a reply , but a genuine question.
Why do so many of you want a DIN-6 port? Technology-wise, it's almost 50 years old. It's huge. If you could , wouldn't you rather have a 2-Meter rig with a Mini-USB, Micro-USB or ( yuck ) USB-C ? Is it the throughput? Is it because "It's what all my cables are already" ?
My perspective is that it's an issue to connect any HT to a computer and have it behave nicely. 1) gotta have the right USB to whatever is offered as a data/mic/speaker port. 2) depending on the OS , you gotta have / find the drivers for this unique cable so that the computer will recognize it and 3) now that the radio and computer "CAN" talk to each other, can it communicate? Was that 9600 baud or 14400? Is there a CRC?
Our cellphones do this with nearly no effort - why can't manufacturers?
Al
K7AOZ

Re: Good 2m rig?

Basil Gunn
 

Not so much as a reply , but a genuine question.
Why do so many of you want a DIN-6 port? Technology-wise, it's almost
50 years old. It's huge.
Compared to what? DB-15, DB-9? not really.

If you could , wouldn't you rather have a 2-Meter rig with a Mini-USB,
Micro-USB or ( yuck ) USB-C ?
Nope. I would rather have a mDin6 to mDin6 cable that goes from my DRAWS
Hat to the radio. Cheap cable and supported by many radios.

Is it the throughput?
Nope

Is it because "It's what all my cables are already" ?
Nope

My perspective is that it's an issue to connect any HT to a computer
and have it behave nicely.
Granted an HT is a different cable.
For me HT is a novelty and mobilinkd with APRSdroid does a good job there.

1) gotta have the right USB to whatever is offered as a data/mic/speaker
port.
2) depending on the OS , you gotta have / find the drivers for this
unique cable so that the computer will recognize it and
3) now that the radio and computer "CAN" talk to each other, can it communicate? Was that 9600 baud or 14400? Is there a CRC?
Our cellphones do this with nearly no effort - why can't manufacturers?
Al
K7AOZ

2m rig Update

Steve McGrane <temporarilyoffline@...>
 

IT WORKS!  (so far)
Untitled.png
With my makeshift TM-281 cable I was able to receive an APRS message sent from my potatofeng using the APRS-K2 cable plugged into my android.

Next I have to send a message from my 281 and receive it on my droid.

Then I'll be able to start working on Xastir.  Anybody got any docs for getting Xastir to work with DRAWS?

Re: Good 2m rig?

 

Al,

A very reasonable question.  The mini DIN-6 configuration is the amateur radio version of an analog radio interface.  It contains key signals.  PTT (to radio), COR (from Radio), AF Audio Out (from Radio), Modulator In (to Radio), Discriminator Out (from radio), and a common ground.   It was standardized for interconnection of external modems (including TNCs), as you say, decades ago.

It was adopted for the DRAWS™ HAT so that a straight through cable with male mini DIN-6 plugs would make an easy radio interface for the audio/modem + PTT/COR connection.  If a radio has the same signals but on a different connector then a cable must be made or purchased with proper wiring.

This generation of connection did not include radio control (beyond PTT).

While the mini-DIN 6 comes very close to a standard, not so for rig control with each manufacturer implementing their own version of CAT/CI-V  some use serial ports, some USB ports, some other data jack.

To build a general interface, NW Digital Radio took what would reach the most radios.  USB connections for rig control (and audio if the radio supports it) plus 2 mini DIN-6 connections for audio and COR/PTT.   I personally prefer the hardware PTT of the GPIO connection through the mini DIN-6, when the application supports it, vs CAT control of an unknown baud rate and interface.  Many VHF/UHF radios don't even have rig control and simply use the mini DIN-6.



On Fri, May 24, 2019 at 2:16 PM Al Szymanski via Groups.Io <aszy=mac.com@groups.io> wrote:
Not so much as a reply , but a genuine question.
Why do so many of you want a DIN-6 port? Technology-wise, it's almost 50 years old. It's huge. If you could , wouldn't you rather have a 2-Meter rig with a Mini-USB, Micro-USB or ( yuck ) USB-C ? Is it the throughput? Is it because "It's what all my cables are already" ?
My perspective is that it's an issue to connect any HT to a computer and have it behave nicely. 1) gotta have the right USB to whatever is offered as a data/mic/speaker port. 2) depending on the OS , you gotta have / find the drivers for this unique cable so that the computer will recognize it and 3) now that the radio and computer "CAN" talk to each other, can it communicate? Was that 9600 baud or 14400? Is there a CRC?
Our cellphones do this with nearly no effort - why can't manufacturers?
Al
K7AOZ
 
John D. Hays
Kingston, WA
K7VE

 

Re: 2m rig Update

Basil Gunn
 

Steve McGrane <temporarilyoffline@...> writes:

IT WORKS! (so far)
Nice work Steve.

[image: Untitled.png]
With my makeshift TM-281 cable I was able to receive an APRS message sent
from my potatofeng using the APRS-K2 cable plugged into my android.

Next I have to send a message from my 281 and receive it on my droid.

Then I'll be able to start working on Xastir. Anybody got any docs for
getting Xastir to work with DRAWS?
The lastest version is installed on the DRAWS Beta image
Xastir V2.1.1

This points to some notes I made to get Xastir working.

https://github.com/nwdigitalradio/n7nix/tree/master/xastir

/Basil

Re: 2m rig Update

 

Start XASTIR  and go into interfaces, then configure an AGW or KISS over TCP connection. You can also configure a GPSD interface to localhost for position reports from the integrated GPS.


On Fri, May 24, 2019, 14:34 Steve McGrane <temporarilyoffline@...> wrote:
IT WORKS!  (so far)
Untitled.png
With my makeshift TM-281 cable I was able to receive an APRS message sent from my potatofeng using the APRS-K2 cable plugged into my android.

Next I have to send a message from my 281 and receive it on my droid.

Then I'll be able to start working on Xastir.  Anybody got any docs for getting Xastir to work with DRAWS?

Re: 2m rig Update

Steve McGrane <temporarilyoffline@...>
 

image.png


I guessed at those two and they are both "UP" and I even got a CLI output on the direwolf console... now to get them to do anything...  (my map is blank, even after my self-beaconing)

Still running through Basil's directions.


On Fri, May 24, 2019 at 5:14 PM John D Hays - K7VE <john@...> wrote:
Start XASTIR  and go into interfaces, then configure an AGW or KISS over TCP connection. You can also configure a GPSD interface to localhost for position reports from the integrated GPS.

On Fri, May 24, 2019, 14:34 Steve McGrane <temporarilyoffline@...> wrote:
IT WORKS!  (so far)
Untitled.png
With my makeshift TM-281 cable I was able to receive an APRS message sent from my potatofeng using the APRS-K2 cable plugged into my android.

Next I have to send a message from my 281 and receive it on my droid.

Then I'll be able to start working on Xastir.  Anybody got any docs for getting Xastir to work with DRAWS?

Re: 2m rig Update

 

Your device 0 looks incorrect. Core servers would be something like noam.aprs2.net 

The direwolf would be localhost:8000 or 8001 depending on protocol. 

On Fri, May 24, 2019, 15:49 Steve McGrane <temporarilyoffline@...> wrote:
image.png


I guessed at those two and they are both "UP" and I even got a CLI output on the direwolf console... now to get them to do anything...  (my map is blank, even after my self-beaconing)

Still running through Basil's directions.

On Fri, May 24, 2019 at 5:14 PM John D Hays - K7VE <john@...> wrote:
Start XASTIR  and go into interfaces, then configure an AGW or KISS over TCP connection. You can also configure a GPSD interface to localhost for position reports from the integrated GPS.

On Fri, May 24, 2019, 14:34 Steve McGrane <temporarilyoffline@...> wrote:
IT WORKS!  (so far)
Untitled.png
With my makeshift TM-281 cable I was able to receive an APRS message sent from my potatofeng using the APRS-K2 cable plugged into my android.

Next I have to send a message from my 281 and receive it on my droid.

Then I'll be able to start working on Xastir.  Anybody got any docs for getting Xastir to work with DRAWS?

Re: 2m rig Update

Steve McGrane <temporarilyoffline@...>
 

Core INET is just a comment, I can make it say anything (DRAWS)?



On Fri, May 24, 2019 at 5:53 PM John D Hays - K7VE <john@...> wrote:
Your device 0 looks incorrect. Core servers would be something like noam.aprs2.net 

The direwolf would be localhost:8000 or 8001 depending on protocol. 

On Fri, May 24, 2019, 15:49 Steve McGrane <temporarilyoffline@...> wrote:
image.png


I guessed at those two and they are both "UP" and I even got a CLI output on the direwolf console... now to get them to do anything...  (my map is blank, even after my self-beaconing)

Still running through Basil's directions.

On Fri, May 24, 2019 at 5:14 PM John D Hays - K7VE <john@...> wrote:
Start XASTIR  and go into interfaces, then configure an AGW or KISS over TCP connection. You can also configure a GPSD interface to localhost for position reports from the integrated GPS.

On Fri, May 24, 2019, 14:34 Steve McGrane <temporarilyoffline@...> wrote:
IT WORKS!  (so far)
Untitled.png
With my makeshift TM-281 cable I was able to receive an APRS message sent from my potatofeng using the APRS-K2 cable plugged into my android.

Next I have to send a message from my 281 and receive it on my droid.

Then I'll be able to start working on Xastir.  Anybody got any docs for getting Xastir to work with DRAWS?

Re: 2m rig Update

Basil Gunn
 

From my Xastir install doc device 0 should be:
Networked AGWPE (localhost:8000)
/Basil

Steve McGrane <temporarilyoffline@...> writes:

[image: image.png]


I guessed at those two and they are both "UP" and I even got a CLI output
on the direwolf console... now to get them to do anything... (my map is
blank, even after my self-beaconing)

Still running through Basil's directions.

On Fri, May 24, 2019 at 5:14 PM John D Hays - K7VE <@john_hays> wrote:

Start XASTIR and go into interfaces, then configure an AGW or KISS over
TCP connection. You can also configure a GPSD interface to localhost for
position reports from the integrated GPS.

On Fri, May 24, 2019, 14:34 Steve McGrane <temporarilyoffline@...>
wrote:

IT WORKS! (so far)
[image: Untitled.png]
With my makeshift TM-281 cable I was able to receive an APRS message sent
from my potatofeng using the APRS-K2 cable plugged into my android.

Next I have to send a message from my 281 and receive it on my droid.

Then I'll be able to start working on Xastir. Anybody got any docs for
getting Xastir to work with DRAWS?

Re: 2m rig Update

David Lowry
 

https://imgur.com/iMaXWRR

Not sure if it is correct but is sure fills up my map.

Re: 2m rig Update

Steve McGrane <temporarilyoffline@...>
 

So far I can receive only.

I'm getting a little screwed up in the pin labeling and what side of the cable I'm on.

What I have so far:

Cable from DRAWS w/end cut reveals

Pin 6 Green
Pin 5 Black
Pin 4 Orange
Pin 3 Yellow
Pin 2 Brown
Pin 1 Red

Radio uses an RJ-45 MIC cable and a speaker audio

Pin 1 N/C
Pin 2 DC 8V
Pin 3 GND
Pin 4 PTT
Pin 5 GND (MIC)
Pin 6 MIC
Pin 7 N/C
Pin 8 DTMF Data

Plus TRS on rear audio 1/8th jack

I have
DRAWS = Radio
1 = 6
2 = 5
3 = 4
4 = N/C
5 = Rear Speaker TIP
6 = N/C
GND = N/C

Any thoughts?


On Fri, May 24, 2019 at 6:47 PM David Lowry <huskyrunnr@...> wrote:
https://imgur.com/iMaXWRR

Not sure if it is correct but is sure fills up my map.

Draws hat #draws

Rob Lapham
 

It would be nice to have a little more information 
on shipping dates, and order status 

Re: Using a PiDrive with Draws Hat #draws #pidrive

okiejim
 

Success!!!
I unplugged all my accessories and also unhooked the drive power from the Pi. So I have two power inputs at this time. The Pi is powered by the 12 volts from the Draws Hat and the Drive is powered via the USB cable to and external USB charger. I have beta13 running and had it on all night. No smoke and still running. I have not hooked it up to a radio yet but I do suspect it will run fine. I will try a radio later on once I build up a cable. I plan to run Xastir with a TenTec 1220 2m kit. More to come. At this time I am not going to try to hook the drive up to the pi. I think that may have been the over draw that caused the smoke signal not sure yet but nothing burned out yet.

Re: Using a PiDrive with Draws Hat #draws #pidrive

okiejim
 

I just plugged the harddrive into a USB port on the Pi3. I now get the lightning bolt when the drvie is accessed. When idle the lightning bolt is not on. So it is working but un-sure at this point about other devices. I will run it this way over the weekend to see if it holds up. I do see all of the partitions I built with the WDLabs image so that is cool. I am running the beta13 image right now. I have mis-placed my ps2 female pig tail. When I find it I will solder up a connector for the 2m rig and see if I have enough power to drive the radio audio. More to come.

Re: Using a PiDrive with Draws Hat #draws #pidrive

Christopher Warren
 

The problem you are experiencing is being caused by the lack of power to run the hard drive.
Buy yourself a Y USB splitter to allow the drive to be powered from a separate supply. Make sure the voltage does not also supply the RPI. I had to cut the positive lead in the y splitter cable. So be careful.

On Sat, 25 May 2019, 21:00 okiejim, <kd6vpe@...> wrote:
I just plugged the harddrive into a USB port on the Pi3. I now get the lightning bolt when the drvie is accessed. When idle the lightning bolt is not on. So it is working but un-sure at this point about other devices. I will run it this way over the weekend to see if it holds up. I do see all of the partitions I built with the WDLabs image so that is cool. I am running the beta13 image right now. I have mis-placed my ps2 female pig tail. When I find it I will solder up a connector for the 2m rig and see if I have enough power to drive the radio audio. More to come.

Re: Good 2m rig?

WA7SKG <wa7skg@...>
 

You are comparing apples and oranges. The "Data Port" on ham radios is a misnomer. It is a port for audio connections, just like the microphone jack. It typically has PTT, TX and RX audio (often from two locations in the radio for wide/narrow audio bandwidth), COS, and other signals. This is designed to use with some hardware interface (TNC, modem, etc.) or sound card (Signalink, etc.) device. Your USB connectors are for just that, USB connections for power and data transfer. Trying to use a mini-USB (4 pins) connector or micro-USB (5 pins) for an analog signal cable is a recipe for disaster.

When manufacturers first started interfacing with radios, they simply used the microphone connector. This often required the use of an external switch box go go between the TNC and the microphone so the radio could be used for dual purposes. Then, users wanted to hook both devices simultaneously, plus wanted added features (discriminator tap for UHF packet, COS, etc.) The mini-DIN 6 pin connector was an industry standard at the time, used for PS/2 connections to computers and other purposes. Readily available, inexpensive, smaller than Molex or DB connectors, it was a good choice and became somewhat a standard for the purpose.

So, hopefully, that may answer your "Why do so many of you want a DIN-6 port?" question.

Your other comments regarding the different HT/computer interfaces, compatibilities between adapter/OS, drivers, baud rates, etc. are a totally different issue. That is regarding purely data interfaces via USB and converted serial data. Completely irrelevant to the conversation at hand.

73,
Michael WA7SKG


Al Szymanski via Groups.Io wrote on 5/24/19 2:01 PM:

Not so much as a reply , but a genuine question.
Why do so many of you want a DIN-6 port? Technology-wise, it's almost 50 years old. It's huge. If you could , wouldn't you rather have a 2-Meter rig with a Mini-USB, Micro-USB or ( yuck ) USB-C ? Is it the throughput? Is it because "It's what all my cables are already" ?
My perspective is that it's an issue to connect any HT to a computer and have it behave nicely. 1) gotta have the right USB to whatever is offered as a data/mic/speaker port. 2) depending on the OS , you gotta have / find the drivers for this unique cable so that the computer will recognize it and 3) now that the radio and computer "CAN" talk to each other, can it communicate? Was that 9600 baud or 14400? Is there a CRC?
Our cellphones do this with nearly no effort - why can't manufacturers?
Al
K7AOZ

Re: Good 2m rig?

Doug Henry
 

The Icom IC-7000 has a data port that works well for packet.

Doug VE1ZG

On Sat, 25 May 2019 at 16:24, WA7SKG via Groups.Io <wa7skg=yahoo.com@groups.io> wrote:
You are comparing apples and oranges. The "Data Port" on ham radios is a
misnomer. It is a port for audio connections, just like the microphone
jack. It typically has PTT, TX and RX audio (often from two locations in
the radio for wide/narrow audio bandwidth), COS, and other signals. This
is designed to use with some hardware interface (TNC, modem, etc.) or
sound card (Signalink, etc.) device. Your USB connectors are for just
that, USB connections for power and data transfer. Trying to use a
mini-USB (4 pins) connector or micro-USB (5 pins) for an analog signal
cable is a recipe for disaster.

When manufacturers first started interfacing with radios, they simply
used the microphone connector. This often required the use of an
external switch box go go between the TNC and the microphone so the
radio could be used for dual purposes. Then, users wanted to hook both
devices simultaneously, plus wanted added features (discriminator tap
for UHF packet, COS, etc.) The mini-DIN 6 pin connector was an industry
standard at the time, used for PS/2 connections to computers and other
purposes. Readily available, inexpensive, smaller than Molex or DB
connectors, it was a good choice and became somewhat a standard for the
purpose.

So, hopefully, that may answer your "Why do so many of you want a DIN-6
port?" question.

Your other comments regarding the different HT/computer interfaces,
compatibilities between adapter/OS, drivers, baud rates, etc. are a
totally different issue. That is regarding purely data interfaces via
USB and converted serial data. Completely irrelevant to the conversation
at hand.

73,
Michael WA7SKG


Al Szymanski via Groups.Io wrote on 5/24/19 2:01 PM:
> Not so much as a reply , but a genuine question.
> Why do so many of you want a DIN-6 port? Technology-wise, it's almost 50
> years old. It's huge. If you could , wouldn't you rather have a 2-Meter
> rig with a Mini-USB, Micro-USB or ( yuck ) USB-C ? Is it the throughput?
> Is it because "It's what all my cables are already" ?
> My perspective is that it's an issue to connect any HT to a computer and
> have it behave nicely. 1) gotta have the right USB to whatever is
> offered as a data/mic/speaker port. 2) depending on the OS , you gotta
> have / find the drivers for this unique cable so that the computer will
> recognize it and 3) now that the radio and computer "CAN" talk to each
> other, can it communicate? Was that 9600 baud or 14400? Is there a CRC?
> Our cellphones do this with nearly no effort - why can't manufacturers?
> Al
> K7AOZ



Re: Good 2m rig?

 

The Icom IC-7000 has a data port that works well for packet.
6 pin mini-din or other?

1200 baud and/or 9600 baud?

Re: Good 2m rig?

Doug Henry
 

Bill, 6 pin mini din 1200 and 9600  although I've only used on 1200.

Doug VE1ZG

On Sat, 25 May 2019 at 19:59, Bill Vodall <wa7nwp@...> wrote:
> The Icom IC-7000 has a data port that works well for packet.

6 pin mini-din or other?

1200 baud and/or 9600 baud?