Topics

Good 2m rig?

 

Al,

A very reasonable question.  The mini DIN-6 configuration is the amateur radio version of an analog radio interface.  It contains key signals.  PTT (to radio), COR (from Radio), AF Audio Out (from Radio), Modulator In (to Radio), Discriminator Out (from radio), and a common ground.   It was standardized for interconnection of external modems (including TNCs), as you say, decades ago.

It was adopted for the DRAWS™ HAT so that a straight through cable with male mini DIN-6 plugs would make an easy radio interface for the audio/modem + PTT/COR connection.  If a radio has the same signals but on a different connector then a cable must be made or purchased with proper wiring.

This generation of connection did not include radio control (beyond PTT).

While the mini-DIN 6 comes very close to a standard, not so for rig control with each manufacturer implementing their own version of CAT/CI-V  some use serial ports, some USB ports, some other data jack.

To build a general interface, NW Digital Radio took what would reach the most radios.  USB connections for rig control (and audio if the radio supports it) plus 2 mini DIN-6 connections for audio and COR/PTT.   I personally prefer the hardware PTT of the GPIO connection through the mini DIN-6, when the application supports it, vs CAT control of an unknown baud rate and interface.  Many VHF/UHF radios don't even have rig control and simply use the mini DIN-6.



On Fri, May 24, 2019 at 2:16 PM Al Szymanski via Groups.Io <aszy=mac.com@groups.io> wrote:
Not so much as a reply , but a genuine question.
Why do so many of you want a DIN-6 port? Technology-wise, it's almost 50 years old. It's huge. If you could , wouldn't you rather have a 2-Meter rig with a Mini-USB, Micro-USB or ( yuck ) USB-C ? Is it the throughput? Is it because "It's what all my cables are already" ?
My perspective is that it's an issue to connect any HT to a computer and have it behave nicely. 1) gotta have the right USB to whatever is offered as a data/mic/speaker port. 2) depending on the OS , you gotta have / find the drivers for this unique cable so that the computer will recognize it and 3) now that the radio and computer "CAN" talk to each other, can it communicate? Was that 9600 baud or 14400? Is there a CRC?
Our cellphones do this with nearly no effort - why can't manufacturers?
Al
K7AOZ
 
John D. Hays
Kingston, WA
K7VE

 

WA7SKG <wa7skg@...>
 

You are comparing apples and oranges. The "Data Port" on ham radios is a misnomer. It is a port for audio connections, just like the microphone jack. It typically has PTT, TX and RX audio (often from two locations in the radio for wide/narrow audio bandwidth), COS, and other signals. This is designed to use with some hardware interface (TNC, modem, etc.) or sound card (Signalink, etc.) device. Your USB connectors are for just that, USB connections for power and data transfer. Trying to use a mini-USB (4 pins) connector or micro-USB (5 pins) for an analog signal cable is a recipe for disaster.

When manufacturers first started interfacing with radios, they simply used the microphone connector. This often required the use of an external switch box go go between the TNC and the microphone so the radio could be used for dual purposes. Then, users wanted to hook both devices simultaneously, plus wanted added features (discriminator tap for UHF packet, COS, etc.) The mini-DIN 6 pin connector was an industry standard at the time, used for PS/2 connections to computers and other purposes. Readily available, inexpensive, smaller than Molex or DB connectors, it was a good choice and became somewhat a standard for the purpose.

So, hopefully, that may answer your "Why do so many of you want a DIN-6 port?" question.

Your other comments regarding the different HT/computer interfaces, compatibilities between adapter/OS, drivers, baud rates, etc. are a totally different issue. That is regarding purely data interfaces via USB and converted serial data. Completely irrelevant to the conversation at hand.

73,
Michael WA7SKG


Al Szymanski via Groups.Io wrote on 5/24/19 2:01 PM:

Not so much as a reply , but a genuine question.
Why do so many of you want a DIN-6 port? Technology-wise, it's almost 50 years old. It's huge. If you could , wouldn't you rather have a 2-Meter rig with a Mini-USB, Micro-USB or ( yuck ) USB-C ? Is it the throughput? Is it because "It's what all my cables are already" ?
My perspective is that it's an issue to connect any HT to a computer and have it behave nicely. 1) gotta have the right USB to whatever is offered as a data/mic/speaker port. 2) depending on the OS , you gotta have / find the drivers for this unique cable so that the computer will recognize it and 3) now that the radio and computer "CAN" talk to each other, can it communicate? Was that 9600 baud or 14400? Is there a CRC?
Our cellphones do this with nearly no effort - why can't manufacturers?
Al
K7AOZ

Doug Henry
 

The Icom IC-7000 has a data port that works well for packet.

Doug VE1ZG

On Sat, 25 May 2019 at 16:24, WA7SKG via Groups.Io <wa7skg=yahoo.com@groups.io> wrote:
You are comparing apples and oranges. The "Data Port" on ham radios is a
misnomer. It is a port for audio connections, just like the microphone
jack. It typically has PTT, TX and RX audio (often from two locations in
the radio for wide/narrow audio bandwidth), COS, and other signals. This
is designed to use with some hardware interface (TNC, modem, etc.) or
sound card (Signalink, etc.) device. Your USB connectors are for just
that, USB connections for power and data transfer. Trying to use a
mini-USB (4 pins) connector or micro-USB (5 pins) for an analog signal
cable is a recipe for disaster.

When manufacturers first started interfacing with radios, they simply
used the microphone connector. This often required the use of an
external switch box go go between the TNC and the microphone so the
radio could be used for dual purposes. Then, users wanted to hook both
devices simultaneously, plus wanted added features (discriminator tap
for UHF packet, COS, etc.) The mini-DIN 6 pin connector was an industry
standard at the time, used for PS/2 connections to computers and other
purposes. Readily available, inexpensive, smaller than Molex or DB
connectors, it was a good choice and became somewhat a standard for the
purpose.

So, hopefully, that may answer your "Why do so many of you want a DIN-6
port?" question.

Your other comments regarding the different HT/computer interfaces,
compatibilities between adapter/OS, drivers, baud rates, etc. are a
totally different issue. That is regarding purely data interfaces via
USB and converted serial data. Completely irrelevant to the conversation
at hand.

73,
Michael WA7SKG


Al Szymanski via Groups.Io wrote on 5/24/19 2:01 PM:
> Not so much as a reply , but a genuine question.
> Why do so many of you want a DIN-6 port? Technology-wise, it's almost 50
> years old. It's huge. If you could , wouldn't you rather have a 2-Meter
> rig with a Mini-USB, Micro-USB or ( yuck ) USB-C ? Is it the throughput?
> Is it because "It's what all my cables are already" ?
> My perspective is that it's an issue to connect any HT to a computer and
> have it behave nicely. 1) gotta have the right USB to whatever is
> offered as a data/mic/speaker port. 2) depending on the OS , you gotta
> have / find the drivers for this unique cable so that the computer will
> recognize it and 3) now that the radio and computer "CAN" talk to each
> other, can it communicate? Was that 9600 baud or 14400? Is there a CRC?
> Our cellphones do this with nearly no effort - why can't manufacturers?
> Al
> K7AOZ



 

The Icom IC-7000 has a data port that works well for packet.
6 pin mini-din or other?

1200 baud and/or 9600 baud?

Doug Henry
 

Bill, 6 pin mini din 1200 and 9600  although I've only used on 1200.

Doug VE1ZG

On Sat, 25 May 2019 at 19:59, Bill Vodall <wa7nwp@...> wrote:
> The Icom IC-7000 has a data port that works well for packet.

6 pin mini-din or other?

1200 baud and/or 9600 baud?



Keith Williamson
 

I now have a TM-V71a connected to my UDRC and am trying to get rigctl to work with it. I have an equivalent of a PG-5H connected to a serial/USB converter enumerated as /dev/ttyUSB0. My first test of the cable was with chirp and it seems to work fine. 

When I try ""rigctl -m 234 -r /dev/ttyUSB0 -vvvv", I see multiple read_string timeouts and then rigctl enters command mode. When I try "f" to get the current vfo frequency, I get multiple read_string timeouts and finally "get_freq: error = Communication timed out". 

Are there specific serial params needed to talk to the V71a? (e.g. RTS/CTS flow control, specific baud rate)?

Thanks for any help!

Keith
KF7DRV



On Sat, May 25, 2019 at 4:13 PM Doug Henry <doug.henry1@...> wrote:
Bill, 6 pin mini din 1200 and 9600  although I've only used on 1200.

Doug VE1ZG

On Sat, 25 May 2019 at 19:59, Bill Vodall <wa7nwp@...> wrote:
> The Icom IC-7000 has a data port that works well for packet.

6 pin mini-din or other?

1200 baud and/or 9600 baud?



Basil Gunn
 

Check out a recent script (wlgw-check.sh) I wrote for rig control of the tm-v71.
https://github.com/n7nix/auto-rmsgw-find
This script iterates through a list of RMS gateways using a TM-V71a and Hamlib rigctl
/Basil


On May 31, 2019 5:43:34 PM PDT, Keith Williamson <hkwilliamson@...> wrote:
I now have a TM-V71a connected to my UDRC and am trying to get rigctl to work with it. I have an equivalent of a PG-5H connected to a serial/USB converter enumerated as /dev/ttyUSB0. My first test of the cable was with chirp and it seems to work fine. 

When I try ""rigctl -m 234 -r /dev/ttyUSB0 -vvvv", I see multiple read_string timeouts and then rigctl enters command mode. When I try "f" to get the current vfo frequency, I get multiple read_string timeouts and finally "get_freq: error = Communication timed out". 

Are there specific serial params needed to talk to the V71a? (e.g. RTS/CTS flow control, specific baud rate)?

Thanks for any help!

Keith
KF7DRV



On Sat, May 25, 2019 at 4:13 PM Doug Henry <doug.henry1@...> wrote:
Bill, 6 pin mini din 1200 and 9600  although I've only used on 1200.

Doug VE1ZG

On Sat, 25 May 2019 at 19:59, Bill Vodall <wa7nwp@...> wrote:
> The Icom IC-7000 has a data port that works well for packet.

6 pin mini-din or other?

1200 baud and/or 9600 baud?



Basil Gunn
 

Try setting the PC baud rate on the radio to 57600.
Also try connecting a serial program like screen and typing in the radio ID string. It should respond with 'OK'.
screen /dev/ttyUSB0 57600

TMV71 or D700
When I'm in front of my radio again I'll find out which works.
/Basil n7nix


On May 31, 2019 10:45:22 PM PDT, Basil Gunn <basil@...> wrote:
Check out a recent script (wlgw-check.sh) I wrote for rig control of the tm-v71.
https://github.com/n7nix/auto-rmsgw-find
This script iterates through a list of RMS gateways using a TM-V71a and Hamlib rigctl
/Basil

On May 31, 2019 5:43:34 PM PDT, Keith Williamson <hkwilliamson@...> wrote:
I now have a TM-V71a connected to my UDRC and am trying to get rigctl to work with it. I have an equivalent of a PG-5H connected to a serial/USB converter enumerated as /dev/ttyUSB0. My first test of the cable was with chirp and it seems to work fine. 

When I try ""rigctl -m 234 -r /dev/ttyUSB0 -vvvv", I see multiple read_string timeouts and then rigctl enters command mode. When I try "f" to get the current vfo frequency, I get multiple read_string timeouts and finally "get_freq: error = Communication timed out". 

Are there specific serial params needed to talk to the V71a? (e.g. RTS/CTS flow control, specific baud rate)?

Thanks for any help!

Keith
KF7DRV



On Sat, May 25, 2019 at 4:13 PM Doug Henry <doug.henry1@...> wrote:
Bill, 6 pin mini din 1200 and 9600  although I've only used on 1200.

Doug VE1ZG

On Sat, 25 May 2019 at 19:59, Bill Vodall <wa7nwp@...> wrote:
> The Icom IC-7000 has a data port that works well for packet.

6 pin mini-din or other?

1200 baud and/or 9600 baud?



Keith Williamson
 

Thanks, Basil.

I had a couple of issues. I had tried to configure Fldigi to use Hamlib for rig control. That seemed to have hung the PC interface in the radio until I power cycled it. Additionally, I saw a few undervoltage warnings in dmesg so I switched to a beefier supply.

After changing out the Pi power supply and power cycling the radio, rigctl is working fine at 57600.

So now I need to figure out how to use Hamlib in Fldigi. Here is how I have it configured (although I currently have "Use Hamlib" unchecked). I figure I want to continue to use GPIO 23 for PTT (via the GPIO tab) so I have PTT via Hamlib command unchecked. 

What should be used for flow control? Anything on this panel pop out to you as an issue?

image.png

Thanks,

Keith
KF7DRV


On Sat, Jun 1, 2019 at 6:59 AM Basil Gunn <basil@...> wrote:
Try setting the PC baud rate on the radio to 57600.
Also try connecting a serial program like screen and typing in the radio ID string. It should respond with 'OK'.
screen /dev/ttyUSB0 57600

TMV71 or D700
When I'm in front of my radio again I'll find out which works.
/Basil n7nix

On May 31, 2019 10:45:22 PM PDT, Basil Gunn <basil@...> wrote:
Check out a recent script (wlgw-check.sh) I wrote for rig control of the tm-v71.
https://github.com/n7nix/auto-rmsgw-find
This script iterates through a list of RMS gateways using a TM-V71a and Hamlib rigctl
/Basil

On May 31, 2019 5:43:34 PM PDT, Keith Williamson <hkwilliamson@...> wrote:
I now have a TM-V71a connected to my UDRC and am trying to get rigctl to work with it. I have an equivalent of a PG-5H connected to a serial/USB converter enumerated as /dev/ttyUSB0. My first test of the cable was with chirp and it seems to work fine. 

When I try ""rigctl -m 234 -r /dev/ttyUSB0 -vvvv", I see multiple read_string timeouts and then rigctl enters command mode. When I try "f" to get the current vfo frequency, I get multiple read_string timeouts and finally "get_freq: error = Communication timed out". 

Are there specific serial params needed to talk to the V71a? (e.g. RTS/CTS flow control, specific baud rate)?

Thanks for any help!

Keith
KF7DRV



On Sat, May 25, 2019 at 4:13 PM Doug Henry <doug.henry1@...> wrote:
Bill, 6 pin mini din 1200 and 9600  although I've only used on 1200.

Doug VE1ZG

On Sat, 25 May 2019 at 19:59, Bill Vodall <wa7nwp@...> wrote:
> The Icom IC-7000 has a data port that works well for packet.

6 pin mini-din or other?

1200 baud and/or 9600 baud?



Keith Williamson
 

Hi again,

Got it working. Needed to use RTS/CTS flowcontrol. Now if I change the VFO freq on the radio it's reflected on the Fldigi display and if I change it on the Fldigi display its reflected on the radio. 

Very nice.

I'm already really liking this new TM-V71A radio! 

73,

Keith
KF7DRV


On Sat, Jun 1, 2019 at 12:06 PM Keith Williamson via Groups.Io <hkwilliamson=gmail.com@groups.io> wrote:
Thanks, Basil.

I had a couple of issues. I had tried to configure Fldigi to use Hamlib for rig control. That seemed to have hung the PC interface in the radio until I power cycled it. Additionally, I saw a few undervoltage warnings in dmesg so I switched to a beefier supply.

After changing out the Pi power supply and power cycling the radio, rigctl is working fine at 57600.

So now I need to figure out how to use Hamlib in Fldigi. Here is how I have it configured (although I currently have "Use Hamlib" unchecked). I figure I want to continue to use GPIO 23 for PTT (via the GPIO tab) so I have PTT via Hamlib command unchecked. 

What should be used for flow control? Anything on this panel pop out to you as an issue?

image.png

Thanks,

Keith
KF7DRV


On Sat, Jun 1, 2019 at 6:59 AM Basil Gunn <basil@...> wrote:
Try setting the PC baud rate on the radio to 57600.
Also try connecting a serial program like screen and typing in the radio ID string. It should respond with 'OK'.
screen /dev/ttyUSB0 57600

TMV71 or D700
When I'm in front of my radio again I'll find out which works.
/Basil n7nix

On May 31, 2019 10:45:22 PM PDT, Basil Gunn <basil@...> wrote:
Check out a recent script (wlgw-check.sh) I wrote for rig control of the tm-v71.
https://github.com/n7nix/auto-rmsgw-find
This script iterates through a list of RMS gateways using a TM-V71a and Hamlib rigctl
/Basil

On May 31, 2019 5:43:34 PM PDT, Keith Williamson <hkwilliamson@...> wrote:
I now have a TM-V71a connected to my UDRC and am trying to get rigctl to work with it. I have an equivalent of a PG-5H connected to a serial/USB converter enumerated as /dev/ttyUSB0. My first test of the cable was with chirp and it seems to work fine. 

When I try ""rigctl -m 234 -r /dev/ttyUSB0 -vvvv", I see multiple read_string timeouts and then rigctl enters command mode. When I try "f" to get the current vfo frequency, I get multiple read_string timeouts and finally "get_freq: error = Communication timed out". 

Are there specific serial params needed to talk to the V71a? (e.g. RTS/CTS flow control, specific baud rate)?

Thanks for any help!

Keith
KF7DRV



On Sat, May 25, 2019 at 4:13 PM Doug Henry <doug.henry1@...> wrote:
Bill, 6 pin mini din 1200 and 9600  although I've only used on 1200.

Doug VE1ZG

On Sat, 25 May 2019 at 19:59, Bill Vodall <wa7nwp@...> wrote:
> The Icom IC-7000 has a data port that works well for packet.

6 pin mini-din or other?

1200 baud and/or 9600 baud?